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welcome to shattered reality with your

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hosts kate valentine and Farrugia

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prepare to head her paradigms shifted

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into truths questioned and now shattered

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right I ferocious is he Valentine and

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we're very very happy to have an old

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friend on as our guest today Kathleen

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Martin a very well-known person in the

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you ufology field and the field of

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abductions in the field of more

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interestingly abduction research I think

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Kathleen was one of if not the only

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person along with Denise stoner to

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actually try to quantify some details of

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abduction so that was very interesting

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but certainly I think the way and I

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think as they will agree with me the way

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she got started and all this and she

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happens to be the niece of betty and

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barney him is that correct kathleen that

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is correct yeah you really had some

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first-hand experience that was great I

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nice to speak with you again Kathleen we

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met a couple of times in the past first

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time at Kate Valentine's Atlantic Coast

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UFO convention in atlantic city at the

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cocktail party we had a lovely

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conversation and because of our show not

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being totally involved with UFOs because

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our show leans heavily on areas of

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consciousness and parapsychology and

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remote viewing and other things there

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may be people out in our listening

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audience who do not know the Betty and

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Barney Hill saga that you were a part of

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as a teenager and I wonder without going

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into every detail

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perhaps you can give these people a

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little heads-up about the you know the

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date and kind of the overview of what

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happened I'd be happy to the date was

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September nineteen nineteen sixty one my

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aunt and uncle Betty and Barney Hill

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were returning to their home in

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Portsmouth New Hampshire from a vacation

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to Niagara Falls they went to Toronto

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than to Montreal and we're driving home

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during the night when they had a close

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encounter with the UFO it was so close

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that it actually hovered a hundred feet

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approximately above their vehicle my

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uncle stopped the car got out the craft

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shifted to a field followed it into the

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field he observed individuals on the

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craft that he immediately stated were

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somehow not human they frightened him

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greatly he ran back to the vehicle was

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speeding down the road because he had

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the impression that if he didn't get out

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of there he was going to be captured and

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as he's driving down the road very

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rapidly he and my auntie a series of

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code like buzzing Sam striking the trunk

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of the car they then feel a tingling

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sensation pass through their bodies the

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car is vibrating and the next thing they

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know the 35 miles down the road they

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have very little memory of what happened

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in the interim they remembered a

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roadblock somewhere along the way of

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fiery orb and that was about it they

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went home and they discovered that there

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was physical evidence that they could

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not explain my aunt's dress was torn in

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several places the tops of my uncle's

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best dress shoes were so deeply scraped

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he had to buy new shoes their watches

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had permanently stopped and there was a

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magnetic field around the trunk of the

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car and shiny spots where they heard

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those buzzing sounds they knew that

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something unusual had happened they

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didn't know

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actually what except for the sighting

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they reported it to Pease Air Force Base

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it was very distressing to my uncle who

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would actually observed the nonhumans

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and this caused so much distress that he

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was referred to dr. Benjamin Simon in

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boston massachusetts and he and my aunt

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had separate hypnosis sessions with dr.

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Simon for a period of six months and he

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imposed amnesia at the end of each

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session and they came out with the same

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story of alien abduction their case was

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the first in the United States we were

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not aware of this before this occurred

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one question that I have and I think

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this would be of interest to many of our

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listeners who don't know the story can

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you give a description of said non-human

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entities I can my uncle said that they

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had large heads larger in proportion to

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their bodies and humans they were

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hairless their extremities he described

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as being spindly they were smaller than

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the average human and they spoke

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telepathically and that sort of said to

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seem and a lot of people say well they

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were just describing what a lot of other

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people had to had happened to a lot of

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other people but as you said they were

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the first and they actually made life a

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magazine I believe look look okay and

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yeah they became quite well known at the

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time and there had been a movie made

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back then but then you I think speaking

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with you you said there was going to be

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a remake of that movie it's not a remake

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of that movie mm-hmm it is going to be a

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movie on the book I'm shirred the Betty

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and Barney Hill UFO that was the one you

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co-authored with Stan that my co

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authored with Stanton

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Friedman yes the movie has made been

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made on the the first book that was

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written by john g fuller back in 1915

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Stanton Friedman and I did a case study

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started out of the biography actually

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and I was writing the details of my aunt

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and uncle's lives after both of them had

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passed away but I discovered that there

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was so much fascinating information in

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their files that had never been reported

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to the public that I wrote about this in

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my book and this book is the book that

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has been optioned for a movie that's

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wonderful yes it is by Bryce is able yes

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Jackie is able and by Gotham principal

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producers there they produced Maze

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Runner and the Scorch Trials wow they're

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teaming up with Bryce to work on this

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movie and it's going to be a lot

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different from the first there's still a

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copyright on the first movie this movie

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is going to focus more on the lives of

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Betty and Barney Hill civil rights

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leaders they were an interracial couple

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she was a social worker they were both

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very committed to the civil rights

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movement and to Community Affairs

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prominent in the community they never

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wanted this story to get out to the

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public in the way that it did and so it

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would be more of a movie about their

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lives and the impact that this had on

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their lives and how it changed in a way

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the direction of their lives and it and

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your life as well clearly Oh clearly yes

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we did do you want to repeat the name of

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your book I am the owner of that book

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and I highly recommend it to our

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listeners and if you wanted to repeat

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the name of that book and how people

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could get a copy of the book either in

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an e-form or a

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a hard back for more soft back form

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maybe you could give us the information

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right now sure the book is captured the

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Betty and Barney Hill UFO experience by

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Kathleen Mardon and Stanton Friedman and

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Mardan is ma rden a lot of people think

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it's Martin but it's not and the book is

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available in barnes and noble or you can

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order it online through amazon or barnes

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and noble autographed copies are

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available at my website which is

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kathleen with a k dash Mardan ma rden

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dot-com and you can purchase those using

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paypal on my website great one of the

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interesting things that you brought out

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about your aunt and uncle is that they

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were actually at an inaugural ball which

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is an indication of how well thought of

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they were in the community absolutely

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they campaigned for Lyndon Johnson and

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Johnson was elected my uncle was a

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delegate and I also worked on that

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contain as a teenager and I to received

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an invitation to attend Lyndon Johnson's

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inauguration so Betty and Barney and I

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attended the inauguration well oh but

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what a fantastic experience I hope you

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have a pictures you know it must have

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pictures somewhere I do have one large

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photograph of the entire New Hampshire

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group which I tarish I that must have

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been such a thrill really at that age

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especially yeah so on so um you know I

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know that your aunt continued to be

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involved in the UFO area after your

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uncle unfortunately passed on and you

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also

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have continued as a researcher and with

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MUFON and you want a wonderful prize

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back in 2014 am i right or 2012 from

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MUFON you won the ufologist of the Year

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award did you yeah yes I believe it was

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2012 ok I won that award that was a very

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special moment in my life yes as it must

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be well MUFON is the mutual UFO network

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and it's probably one of the oldest and

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best-known organizations there have been

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others but MUFON seems to survive and

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continue on and you've been very active

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in that I know and actually now you're

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even more active in their experience or

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field I believe yes I am I got a member

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of MUFON since 1991 no here we are Oh

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five years yeah and you can see by my

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longtime membership that I think that

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it's a very good organization primarily

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because in its investigations of events

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it attempts to follow scientific

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protocols we we tend to be as objective

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as possible and to collect physical

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evidence to eyewitness testimony and to

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analyze that evidence to come up with an

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impression of actually occurred so that

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has kept my interest also MUFON

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publishes a monthly magazine and the

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magazine contains very interesting

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articles it's now available online an

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hour in hard copy as well it's an

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organization that is funded by its

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members so we pay an annual fee for the

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the magazine for the membership and that

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helps to fund the organization and we

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have a

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symposium and that symposium is going to

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be held in Orlando a lot of this year so

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the website for MUFON is just WWF on mu

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fon com my current role with MUFON is as

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its director of experience or research

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we used to use the name abduction but I

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know I received so many comments that it

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was not politically correct anymore oh

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oh so we changed it yes we all do

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experiencer people said will implies a

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negative experience and well most of

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them have been and what yes and also one

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that fun receives our negative

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experience uh-huh but we have many many

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people now who are stating that their

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experiences are highly positive and

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spiritual and leading to the Ascension

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process and it's jen tener alee those

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people who are very very vocal and do

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not like the word abduction even though

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you know that's that's what we deal with

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primarily I I am moved on I am an

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experiencer and I know that from my

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point of view that the contact is

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horrifyingly frightening I mean in a

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kind of physiological way it is just

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beyond terrifying the outcome in the

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looking back in the long haul the

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outcome is expanding of one's

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consciousness in a certain sense that

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you can see more of what it it means to

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be alive or that we're not alone in the

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universe kind of knowledge that is is

273
00:15:34,900 --> 00:15:34,210
imparted and i'm not talking about any

274
00:15:37,510 --> 00:15:34,910
particular

275
00:15:41,170 --> 00:15:37,520
secrets imparted but just the concept

276
00:15:42,970 --> 00:15:41,180
that there are other beings and that we

277
00:15:48,150 --> 00:15:42,980
may not be on the top of the food chain

278
00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:48,160
at all well that is absolutely correct

279
00:15:54,940 --> 00:15:52,610
and and I think everybody who has this

280
00:15:58,450 --> 00:15:54,950
type of experience comes to that

281
00:16:02,650 --> 00:15:58,460
realization but it is extremely

282
00:16:06,250 --> 00:16:02,660
frightening for many many people people

283
00:16:09,850 --> 00:16:06,260
are traumatized by these events and what

284
00:16:14,100 --> 00:16:09,860
we have done it move on is too it's

285
00:16:18,130 --> 00:16:14,110
multifaceted for one thing we have

286
00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:18,140
designed a specific protocols for

287
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:22,130
investigation where we are looking for

288
00:16:28,350 --> 00:16:24,010
any evidence that we can possibly

289
00:16:31,900 --> 00:16:28,360
collect from the experiencer for

290
00:16:35,590 --> 00:16:31,910
laboratory analysis we have a second

291
00:16:39,820 --> 00:16:35,600
component to that and that is support

292
00:16:44,410 --> 00:16:39,830
for experiences because so many people

293
00:16:47,740 --> 00:16:44,420
have difficulty with this so muffins

294
00:16:52,030 --> 00:16:47,750
experience or research team has an

295
00:16:57,220 --> 00:16:52,040
online questionnaire it's 30 questions

296
00:17:01,450 --> 00:16:57,230
and all it is is an introduction to a

297
00:17:05,950 --> 00:17:01,460
member of the ERT so if somebody wants

298
00:17:09,310 --> 00:17:05,960
to discuss confidentially what occurred

299
00:17:12,190 --> 00:17:09,320
to them their concerns or anything else

300
00:17:16,120 --> 00:17:12,200
will have a person on the other end who

301
00:17:21,970 --> 00:17:16,130
will listen without passing judgment

302
00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:21,980
without being critical and if the person

303
00:17:28,170 --> 00:17:25,250
who is seeking help is looking for

304
00:17:33,430 --> 00:17:28,180
support group or looking for a hypnotist

305
00:17:36,270 --> 00:17:33,440
we do what we can to help them by

306
00:17:39,090 --> 00:17:36,280
providing a list of individuals

307
00:17:43,090 --> 00:17:39,100
unfortunately at this point we have only

308
00:17:46,990 --> 00:17:43,100
27 hypnotists in the entire United

309
00:17:48,520 --> 00:17:47,000
States on our list for referrals and

310
00:17:52,380 --> 00:17:48,530
we're looking for more

311
00:17:57,280 --> 00:17:52,390
and if anyone out there listening is

312
00:18:00,790 --> 00:17:57,290
certified hypnotherapist and is either

313
00:18:03,490 --> 00:18:00,800
licensed or certified and has

314
00:18:06,460 --> 00:18:03,500
malpractice insurance and experience in

315
00:18:09,490 --> 00:18:06,470
working with experiences we would

316
00:18:13,930 --> 00:18:09,500
appreciate it if you would get in touch

317
00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:13,940
with me my email address is on my

318
00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:18,890
website Kathleen Mardan calm we also

319
00:18:27,250 --> 00:18:23,450
have a short list of support groups we

320
00:18:29,770 --> 00:18:27,260
definitely need more of those but I and

321
00:18:33,670 --> 00:18:29,780
several other researchers are working on

322
00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:33,680
this problem because people need support

323
00:18:41,590 --> 00:18:37,490
too often experiencers have not been

324
00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:41,600
able to talk to anyone without ridicule

325
00:18:46,750 --> 00:18:43,850
without the possibility of losing their

326
00:18:51,460 --> 00:18:46,760
jobs without the possibility of being

327
00:18:53,530 --> 00:18:51,470
sent to a psychiatrist and it's time for

328
00:18:59,470 --> 00:18:53,540
that to end it's time for the ridicule

329
00:19:01,780 --> 00:18:59,480
to end and that's not ever I think it

330
00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:01,790
slowed down a bit though hasn't it and I

331
00:19:07,990 --> 00:19:03,650
think you've been one of the main

332
00:19:09,790 --> 00:19:08,000
reasons it has the ridicule yeah but the

333
00:19:13,180 --> 00:19:09,800
real i think that people are becoming

334
00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:13,190
more accepting mm-hmm for the most part

335
00:19:24,430 --> 00:19:20,210
and MO and less are not bullying let me

336
00:19:28,180 --> 00:19:24,440
put experiencers as much and there has

337
00:19:31,570 --> 00:19:28,190
been a movement by experiencers to gain

338
00:19:34,270 --> 00:19:31,580
strength in this as well and it doesn't

339
00:19:37,330 --> 00:19:34,280
really matter I mean a lot of people say

340
00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:37,340
show me the evidence surprise right the

341
00:19:43,450 --> 00:19:39,890
way that we perceive this is it doesn't

342
00:19:46,630 --> 00:19:43,460
really matter the individual believes

343
00:19:49,750 --> 00:19:46,640
that it is if that person is

344
00:19:53,350 --> 00:19:49,760
experiencing mental health issues don't

345
00:19:57,400 --> 00:19:53,360
they deserve respect are not we to

346
00:20:01,020 --> 00:19:57,410
respect our individuals our citizens who

347
00:20:02,320 --> 00:20:01,030
have mental health problems surely

348
00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:02,330
absolutely

349
00:20:06,580 --> 00:20:04,250
but I'll tell you as far as show me the

350
00:20:10,450 --> 00:20:06,590
evidence and these being a terrifying

351
00:20:13,419 --> 00:20:10,460
experience kudos to your aunt who stood

352
00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:13,429
up to these beings that had abducted her

353
00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:16,610
and said look I need some proof that

354
00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:19,330
i've been here and bullied one of the

355
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:22,490
abductors into giving her something but

356
00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:25,490
then the whoever the head of abductor

357
00:20:31,060 --> 00:20:28,610
was took it back from her but I and

358
00:20:33,909 --> 00:20:31,070
having had the pleasure of meeting your

359
00:20:35,950 --> 00:20:33,919
aunt very briefly one time I think she

360
00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:35,960
was quite the forceful character that

361
00:20:40,570 --> 00:20:37,490
could have taught these little creatures

362
00:20:42,519 --> 00:20:40,580
into giving or something I always loved

363
00:20:44,549 --> 00:20:42,529
that story that she stood up to him and

364
00:20:47,830 --> 00:20:44,559
said hey give me something to take home

365
00:20:50,620 --> 00:20:47,840
yes she I was great that was it was a

366
00:20:54,850 --> 00:20:50,630
very brave woman I would say so really

367
00:20:57,700 --> 00:20:54,860
um absolutely hats off but that's you

368
00:21:00,330 --> 00:20:57,710
following in her footsteps oh that again

369
00:21:04,060 --> 00:21:00,340
the website was Buffon dot-com

370
00:21:06,639 --> 00:21:04,070
experience or survey that well nature I

371
00:21:08,379 --> 00:21:06,649
was going to say that you started on to

372
00:21:11,529 --> 00:21:08,389
that's a new thing right the research

373
00:21:15,009 --> 00:21:11,539
project yes yes and that's what I wanted

374
00:21:19,899 --> 00:21:15,019
to speak of nests the experiencer survey

375
00:21:22,799 --> 00:21:19,909
which is 118 questions and this is a

376
00:21:27,340 --> 00:21:22,809
survey to you identify commonalities

377
00:21:29,830 --> 00:21:27,350
among experiences and we are trying to

378
00:21:34,419 --> 00:21:29,840
make the scientific because we're going

379
00:21:37,659 --> 00:21:34,429
to in by doing so have several different

380
00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:37,669
phases of this study and some of this

381
00:21:45,690 --> 00:21:41,570
phase some of this will involve the work

382
00:21:48,180 --> 00:21:45,700
of dr. don don dairy who is a retired

383
00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:48,190
psychology professor from mcgill

384
00:21:57,310 --> 00:21:52,610
university and he has a questionnaire

385
00:22:01,590 --> 00:21:57,320
that we will use as well we have some of

386
00:22:05,019 --> 00:22:01,600
the experiencers who take part in this

387
00:22:07,210 --> 00:22:05,029
research project that we're working on

388
00:22:10,389 --> 00:22:07,220
right now right now we have a hundred

389
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:10,399
and seventy participants i'd really love

390
00:22:16,150 --> 00:22:13,970
to have a thousand yeah dell has

391
00:22:19,060 --> 00:22:16,160
horrific did the professor

392
00:22:20,850 --> 00:22:19,070
self ever have any experience not that

393
00:22:24,460 --> 00:22:20,860
I'm aware of but he has a long-term

394
00:22:27,070 --> 00:22:24,470
interest in this topic and has worked on

395
00:22:29,290 --> 00:22:27,080
other research projects okay I

396
00:22:33,010 --> 00:22:29,300
understand that part of this research

397
00:22:36,550 --> 00:22:33,020
that professor Don dairy is involved

398
00:22:40,870 --> 00:22:36,560
with has to do with symbols that have

399
00:22:46,060 --> 00:22:40,880
been seen both by your your aunt and

400
00:22:48,700 --> 00:22:46,070
uncle and also by other experiencers I

401
00:22:52,540 --> 00:22:48,710
wondered how those those symbols

402
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:52,550
correlated if they did at all with those

403
00:23:02,980 --> 00:22:57,050
seen by the people who were enlisted in

404
00:23:05,110 --> 00:23:02,990
the armed services at Rendlesham it's my

405
00:23:10,210 --> 00:23:05,120
understanding that the symbols that

406
00:23:12,700 --> 00:23:10,220
Rendlesham word binary code is that

407
00:23:15,460 --> 00:23:12,710
correct I think some of it was

408
00:23:18,070 --> 00:23:15,470
interpreted that way yes I think I think

409
00:23:21,940 --> 00:23:18,080
the one gentleman who touched the craft

410
00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:21,950
um felt that he had downloaded some

411
00:23:28,360 --> 00:23:25,250
binary sync signals but I don't know

412
00:23:32,130 --> 00:23:28,370
that the anything that was on written or

413
00:23:34,750 --> 00:23:32,140
like embossed on the craft was binary I

414
00:23:38,110 --> 00:23:34,760
think I wanted like a triangle type

415
00:23:39,700 --> 00:23:38,120
thing with lettering inside it well that

416
00:23:42,700 --> 00:23:39,710
would be what I'm wondering about

417
00:23:45,610 --> 00:23:42,710
whether that part correlates it all with

418
00:23:48,700 --> 00:23:45,620
the professor's work I'd have to take a

419
00:23:53,140 --> 00:23:48,710
look at that again what we're seeing as

420
00:23:56,530 --> 00:23:53,150
symbols that seem to be repeated over

421
00:24:01,260 --> 00:23:56,540
and over again in such as the scientific

422
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:01,270
study that dr. Don dairy did is our

423
00:24:08,380 --> 00:24:06,410
lines and dots essentially some of them

424
00:24:11,020 --> 00:24:08,390
are curved lines in some of them

425
00:24:16,110 --> 00:24:11,030
straight lines going in different

426
00:24:18,670 --> 00:24:16,120
directions if you order my books

427
00:24:22,210 --> 00:24:18,680
captured the Betty and Barney Hill UFO

428
00:24:25,930 --> 00:24:22,220
experience Betty's sketch of those

429
00:24:29,919 --> 00:24:25,940
symbols is in the book and her sketch

430
00:24:32,649 --> 00:24:29,929
was compared by dr. Don dairy to scale

431
00:24:36,879 --> 00:24:32,659
that were done by the experiencers who

432
00:24:39,159 --> 00:24:36,889
took part in his academic study and he

433
00:24:41,739 --> 00:24:39,169
said that the there were many

434
00:24:44,710 --> 00:24:41,749
similarities between Betty symbols and

435
00:24:49,049 --> 00:24:44,720
the symbols of from the individuals in

436
00:24:53,019 --> 00:24:49,059
his study and these symbols correlated

437
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:53,029
whereas control groups of graduate

438
00:24:58,029 --> 00:24:55,610
students who were just imagining what

439
00:25:00,180 --> 00:24:58,039
symbols might look like we're nothing

440
00:25:10,090 --> 00:25:00,190
like the symbols drawn by the

441
00:25:12,899 --> 00:25:10,100
experiences in MUFON it may be I am not

442
00:25:17,259 --> 00:25:12,909
correct in this and perhaps you could

443
00:25:21,399 --> 00:25:17,269
straighten me out it seems to me that

444
00:25:26,409 --> 00:25:21,409
the focus is on nuts-and-bolts craft and

445
00:25:29,379 --> 00:25:26,419
on small Grey's not to the total

446
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:29,389
exclusion of other types that might be

447
00:25:37,060 --> 00:25:32,570
seen but would that be a reasonably true

448
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:37,070
statement I yes I I do think that that

449
00:25:45,700 --> 00:25:41,690
is a reasonably true statement MUFON

450
00:25:48,970 --> 00:25:45,710
uses instrumentation and is looking for

451
00:25:51,249 --> 00:25:48,980
physical evidence so the primary focus

452
00:25:57,129 --> 00:25:51,259
is MUFON is upon the collection of

453
00:26:01,269 --> 00:25:57,139
evidence so the so this sort of ideas

454
00:26:05,649 --> 00:26:01,279
promulgated if you will by people like

455
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:05,659
Jacques valet and oh jeez honor the

456
00:26:13,509 --> 00:26:08,210
fellow who did the will help me here

457
00:26:16,989 --> 00:26:13,519
senior moment a fellow who lived in New

458
00:26:21,279 --> 00:26:16,999
York and did oh but Hopkins no did the

459
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:21,289
story about the West Virginia bridge

460
00:26:27,759 --> 00:26:25,970
falling what man yes exactly on the tip

461
00:26:33,820 --> 00:26:27,769
of my tongue but in any case of

462
00:26:36,879 --> 00:26:33,830
something more of a not not not not

463
00:26:41,190 --> 00:26:36,889
space but a little bit more a little

464
00:26:43,570 --> 00:26:41,200
less physical a little more paranormal

465
00:26:46,090 --> 00:26:43,580
presentation

466
00:26:48,940 --> 00:26:46,100
oh yeah Jack fell they felt that there

467
00:26:52,390 --> 00:26:48,950
was perhaps it was these beings were

468
00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:52,400
really like a we almost created them out

469
00:27:01,680 --> 00:26:57,610
of our own mind oh no I'm not sure about

470
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:01,690
daddy is going to be lecturing at the

471
00:27:07,870 --> 00:27:04,730
international UFO Congress conference in

472
00:27:09,730 --> 00:27:07,880
phoenix arizona next month i'm going to

473
00:27:11,980 --> 00:27:09,740
be out there and i'm going to be really

474
00:27:14,380 --> 00:27:11,990
looking forward to hearing his lecture

475
00:27:18,070 --> 00:27:14,390
but it seems like he was ahead of his

476
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:18,080
time because those of us who have done a

477
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:20,690
lot of research on this realize that

478
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:23,810
there are aspects to this phenomenon

479
00:27:36,010 --> 00:27:30,490
that cannot be explained by material

480
00:27:38,410 --> 00:27:36,020
scientists the idea that they can be

481
00:27:41,170 --> 00:27:38,420
solid but they seem to be able to fade

482
00:27:45,930 --> 00:27:41,180
in and out of existence in other words

483
00:27:50,170 --> 00:27:45,940
they can be translucent and and simply

484
00:27:54,910 --> 00:27:50,180
disappear also the same is reported of

485
00:27:57,700 --> 00:27:54,920
the extraterrestrial beings many people

486
00:28:02,130 --> 00:27:57,710
report that they see shadow beings as

487
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:02,140
opposed to solid beings and perhaps they

488
00:28:09,610 --> 00:28:06,250
fade in and out of existence this is

489
00:28:14,490 --> 00:28:09,620
very very difficult very perplexing some

490
00:28:17,890 --> 00:28:14,500
material scientists indeed and there are

491
00:28:20,890 --> 00:28:17,900
theoretical physicists who are working

492
00:28:23,590 --> 00:28:20,900
on this through the foundation for

493
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:23,600
research into extraterrestrial

494
00:28:30,150 --> 00:28:27,250
encounters they are more on the side of

495
00:28:34,150 --> 00:28:30,160
theoretical physics well interestingly

496
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:34,160
enough if we look at the Travis Walton

497
00:28:42,340 --> 00:28:38,090
case he saw a number of different types

498
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:42,350
of beings in his in his abduction

499
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:44,930
experience in his experience her

500
00:28:49,510 --> 00:28:47,570
experience but definitely if you're

501
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:49,520
standing somewhere in the forest than

502
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:52,970
you and you get whooped up as Caedus

503
00:28:57,470 --> 00:28:56,210
want to say that doesn't seem to be in

504
00:29:02,390 --> 00:28:57,480
any way volition

505
00:29:07,150 --> 00:29:02,400
upon the experiences place however he

506
00:29:11,620 --> 00:29:07,160
did see more than one kind of being and

507
00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:11,630
myself as a person in the periphery of

508
00:29:20,690 --> 00:29:16,530
the remote viewing community and an

509
00:29:24,710 --> 00:29:20,700
experiencer many people such as Ingo

510
00:29:29,630 --> 00:29:24,720
Swann have seen inhabit I had

511
00:29:32,090 --> 00:29:29,640
experiences with a tall blond beings

512
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:32,100
sometimes called Nordics sometimes

513
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:34,410
called tall blond types and I know that

514
00:29:38,810 --> 00:29:36,570
there are people playing their amann

515
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:38,820
toises and reptilians and so forth and

516
00:29:45,110 --> 00:29:41,490
so on now you know this is just what

517
00:29:46,700 --> 00:29:45,120
people say and I tend to take people to

518
00:29:49,010 --> 00:29:46,710
some extent that their word and give

519
00:29:53,180 --> 00:29:49,020
them the opportunity to speak their mind

520
00:29:55,490 --> 00:29:53,190
about it so where would you fall in that

521
00:29:59,860 --> 00:29:55,500
in that area do you have any research

522
00:30:04,780 --> 00:29:59,870
let's say on the tall blonde alien types

523
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:04,790
my research on different types is

524
00:30:14,780 --> 00:30:10,130
quantitative and I have looked for

525
00:30:19,220 --> 00:30:14,790
percentages of of individuals who have

526
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:19,230
observed these various types and also on

527
00:30:25,010 --> 00:30:21,450
whether or not these various types of

528
00:30:30,260 --> 00:30:25,020
working together and if so who they're

529
00:30:34,820 --> 00:30:30,270
working for i also have done some

530
00:30:38,570 --> 00:30:34,830
research on the modus operandi the

531
00:30:43,490 --> 00:30:38,580
personality traits of the different

532
00:30:45,919 --> 00:30:43,500
types of beings so yes i have and i have

533
00:30:50,180 --> 00:30:45,929
in and in some of the cases that I've

534
00:30:53,810 --> 00:30:50,190
worked on for example the case of Denise

535
00:30:58,340 --> 00:30:53,820
donor and also of Thomas and Matthew

536
00:31:00,560 --> 00:30:58,350
Reed which are both mentioned and

537
00:31:03,919 --> 00:31:00,570
written about in my book with Denise

538
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:03,929
donor the alien abduction files which is

539
00:31:11,299 --> 00:31:08,490
also available on my website we we see

540
00:31:16,509 --> 00:31:11,309
that mantis type

541
00:31:24,739 --> 00:31:20,180
it it you know it have you come to any

542
00:31:27,529 --> 00:31:24,749
sort of conclusions at all I you know

543
00:31:30,110 --> 00:31:27,539
there's so much information there but

544
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:30,120
it's it's very frustrating it doesn't

545
00:31:35,239 --> 00:31:33,210
seem to point in any bingo direction

546
00:31:38,090 --> 00:31:35,249
like you can just say ah that's what it

547
00:31:39,860 --> 00:31:38,100
is you know it seems like it's all over

548
00:31:43,129 --> 00:31:39,870
the map almost as if it's done on

549
00:31:46,039 --> 00:31:43,139
purpose it could be and that's the

550
00:31:49,659 --> 00:31:46,049
reason for my attempts at quantitative

551
00:31:53,509 --> 00:31:49,669
analysis of this and and the reason that

552
00:31:58,399 --> 00:31:53,519
MUFON is doing another study Denise and

553
00:32:02,090 --> 00:31:58,409
I did a study in 2012 but we had only 45

554
00:32:05,659 --> 00:32:02,100
questions and 75 participants in the

555
00:32:09,820 --> 00:32:05,669
study including the control group MUFON

556
00:32:12,590 --> 00:32:09,830
study is going to be much more

557
00:32:15,109 --> 00:32:12,600
significant in terms of the number of

558
00:32:20,299 --> 00:32:15,119
participants and the number of questions

559
00:32:23,419 --> 00:32:20,309
and hopefully and we have people with

560
00:32:26,810 --> 00:32:23,429
MDS and phd's working on this so

561
00:32:29,450 --> 00:32:26,820
hopefully we will have some more

562
00:32:33,019 --> 00:32:29,460
information if I had all of the answers

563
00:32:36,350 --> 00:32:33,029
I probably would stop researching this

564
00:32:40,789 --> 00:32:36,360
but I don't and what is so fascinating

565
00:32:43,100 --> 00:32:40,799
is the search for the answers yeah how

566
00:32:46,460 --> 00:32:43,110
do you validate that somebody is an

567
00:32:51,529 --> 00:32:46,470
experiencer and a good participant in

568
00:32:54,529 --> 00:32:51,539
this I'm sure you have criteria yes we

569
00:32:58,430 --> 00:32:54,539
do have criteria and some of that is

570
00:33:02,539 --> 00:32:58,440
what experiencers have in common with

571
00:33:06,259 --> 00:33:02,549
the experiences who participated in the

572
00:33:08,359 --> 00:33:06,269
first study we also as I said look for

573
00:33:12,379 --> 00:33:08,369
evidence but many people don't have

574
00:33:15,489 --> 00:33:12,389
evidence I can tell you though that in

575
00:33:18,350 --> 00:33:15,499
our first study we discovered that

576
00:33:22,090 --> 00:33:18,360
eighty-eight percent of those who

577
00:33:25,230 --> 00:33:22,100
participated stated that they had

578
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:25,240
conscious recall of there

579
00:33:31,110 --> 00:33:28,570
abduction experience really that's

580
00:33:34,260 --> 00:33:31,120
pretty significant eighty-eight percent

581
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:34,270
because initially it was that some sort

582
00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:37,810
of an amnesia would be you know brought

583
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:39,810
to effect on these people but that's

584
00:33:46,050 --> 00:33:42,730
eighty percent that's eighty eight

585
00:33:48,060 --> 00:33:46,060
percent of part of it okay or at least

586
00:33:50,190 --> 00:33:48,070
they knew that something had happened

587
00:33:57,420 --> 00:33:50,200
but they were a little unclear about

588
00:34:00,090 --> 00:33:57,430
some of the details yeah now sixty-seven

589
00:34:02,370 --> 00:34:00,100
percent said that they had observed in

590
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:02,380
unconventional craft at less than a

591
00:34:09,450 --> 00:34:06,810
thousand feet prior to their abduction

592
00:34:12,180 --> 00:34:09,460
so those are those are pretty

593
00:34:15,810 --> 00:34:12,190
significant figures it means that it

594
00:34:19,130 --> 00:34:15,820
wasn't sleep paralysis many of them were

595
00:34:21,630 --> 00:34:19,140
outside in their natural environment

596
00:34:26,460 --> 00:34:21,640
they weren't sleeping they weren't

597
00:34:29,370 --> 00:34:26,470
inside their home yeah I think that you

598
00:34:31,980 --> 00:34:29,380
know possibly there are some episodes of

599
00:34:35,720 --> 00:34:31,990
sleep paralysis but basically I think

600
00:34:39,210 --> 00:34:35,730
you we could discount that entirely yes

601
00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:39,220
it's a pretty or you know as an

602
00:34:44,220 --> 00:34:41,410
explanation for what is occurring or

603
00:34:46,170 --> 00:34:44,230
that could be one type of experience and

604
00:34:47,940 --> 00:34:46,180
that's fine but what you're looking for

605
00:34:50,190 --> 00:34:47,950
is the type of experience that you can

606
00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:50,200
actually quantify with people

607
00:34:54,180 --> 00:34:52,450
remembering it and having a craft

608
00:34:57,690 --> 00:34:54,190
involved I mean there may be more than

609
00:34:59,640 --> 00:34:57,700
one type of experience but I'm with you

610
00:35:03,060 --> 00:34:59,650
I'd like to be able to actually quantify

611
00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:03,070
some of these results what was the

612
00:35:09,180 --> 00:35:05,610
overall characteristic on this did they

613
00:35:11,490 --> 00:35:09,190
experience fear or I know you know

614
00:35:13,740 --> 00:35:11,500
Farrugia has said that there was some

615
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:13,750
sort of an Enlightenment type experience

616
00:35:22,230 --> 00:35:18,850
but how did this impinge on their daily

617
00:35:26,250 --> 00:35:22,240
life the majority of individuals who

618
00:35:29,820 --> 00:35:26,260
took part in our study aided that they

619
00:35:34,020 --> 00:35:29,830
were fearful mm-hmm they were scared to

620
00:35:36,740 --> 00:35:34,030
death initially but they after the

621
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:36,750
experience they were also very very

622
00:35:41,670 --> 00:35:39,130
curious okay

623
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:41,680
you know I asked if they could end this

624
00:35:46,769 --> 00:35:44,410
experience would they and that wasn't on

625
00:35:49,769 --> 00:35:46,779
the first questionnaire but I have been

626
00:35:51,660 --> 00:35:49,779
asking people this I'm and the question

627
00:35:55,230 --> 00:35:51,670
on the second questionnaire that we're

628
00:35:58,880 --> 00:35:55,240
trying to quantify but it seems that

629
00:36:03,299 --> 00:35:58,890
many individuals are stating that they

630
00:36:06,180 --> 00:36:03,309
would choose to continue because of

631
00:36:08,700 --> 00:36:06,190
their curiosity because they're looking

632
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:08,710
for answers to their questions hmm

633
00:36:18,390 --> 00:36:13,650
Kathleen I I would remind you of your

634
00:36:23,279 --> 00:36:18,400
co-writers famous statement that humans

635
00:36:25,349 --> 00:36:23,289
are angry Apes with guns and it's one of

636
00:36:28,819 --> 00:36:25,359
my favorite things that Stanton Friedman

637
00:36:32,940 --> 00:36:28,829
ever said and I think that um a

638
00:36:37,380 --> 00:36:32,950
wonderful way to subdue angry apes with

639
00:36:41,870 --> 00:36:37,390
guns without killing them or locking

640
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:41,880
them up is to use the natural biological

641
00:36:50,789 --> 00:36:47,410
state of sleep paralysis to keep humans

642
00:36:53,999 --> 00:36:50,799
from reacting so if you if you are an an

643
00:36:57,900 --> 00:36:54,009
alien or a higher intelligence and you

644
00:37:02,150 --> 00:36:57,910
are aware that all of the larger mammals

645
00:37:04,710 --> 00:37:02,160
on earth experience naturally

646
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:04,720
biologically they naturally experience

647
00:37:11,579 --> 00:37:07,690
sleep paralysis so that they don't jump

648
00:37:15,450 --> 00:37:11,589
out the window when they dream that you

649
00:37:19,829 --> 00:37:15,460
as the higher intelligence could use the

650
00:37:26,849 --> 00:37:19,839
state of sleep paralysis to keep the

651
00:37:31,410 --> 00:37:26,859
human from acting violently or trying to

652
00:37:34,380 --> 00:37:31,420
get away and so forth yes absolutely and

653
00:37:37,470 --> 00:37:34,390
that it apparently is what happened to

654
00:37:41,490 --> 00:37:37,480
my uncle Barney and my aunt betty and

655
00:37:45,029 --> 00:37:41,500
has continued to occur even when the

656
00:37:49,289 --> 00:37:45,039
individual is wide awake and standing in

657
00:37:52,890 --> 00:37:49,299
a field the historically we see that

658
00:37:55,290 --> 00:37:52,900
they have been paralyzed and

659
00:37:57,840 --> 00:37:55,300
and even though they can remember part

660
00:38:01,260 --> 00:37:57,850
of the experience they usually develop

661
00:38:03,690 --> 00:38:01,270
amnesia for part of it as well no I was

662
00:38:06,060 --> 00:38:03,700
just saying that there actually was an

663
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:06,070
experience it was an only sleep

664
00:38:10,410 --> 00:38:08,170
paralysis which it's been tried to

665
00:38:13,260 --> 00:38:10,420
explain away by some of these but I'll

666
00:38:15,720 --> 00:38:13,270
so anyway just to get back to your one

667
00:38:19,290 --> 00:38:15,730
book alien abduction files that you did

668
00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:19,300
with Denise stoner that that's pretty

669
00:38:24,810 --> 00:38:22,450
fascinating stuff and you indicated that

670
00:38:27,420 --> 00:38:24,820
you may have come to a dead end know

671
00:38:32,970 --> 00:38:27,430
after all that research are you still

672
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:32,980
going to soldier on I you know I there

673
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:35,170
are times where I feel terribly

674
00:38:44,460 --> 00:38:40,290
frustrated with the research because oh

675
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:44,470
the trends within the field and the

676
00:38:50,010 --> 00:38:47,170
direction that it's going in I'm going

677
00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:50,020
to continue to soldier on I'm good good

678
00:39:01,620 --> 00:38:55,690
I am doing this research project excuse

679
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:01,630
me but at the same time I'm I'm seeing

680
00:39:09,390 --> 00:39:06,370
trends towards more involvement with the

681
00:39:12,720 --> 00:39:09,400
media as opposed to scientists and I

682
00:39:16,890 --> 00:39:12,730
think my greatest frustration is that so

683
00:39:22,230 --> 00:39:16,900
many of the great scientific minds who

684
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:22,240
had worked in this field earlier people

685
00:39:29,220 --> 00:39:26,290
with with doctorates in their chosen

686
00:39:35,690 --> 00:39:29,230
field for example such as dr. James

687
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:35,700
harder such as dr. Allen Hynek have and

688
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:39,370
dr. James McDonald they have passed away

689
00:39:49,170 --> 00:39:44,490
and and then not being replaced by

690
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:49,180
younger people who have a scientific

691
00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:52,210
interest in this and that is what

692
00:39:59,280 --> 00:39:54,850
disturbs me about the current trend is

693
00:40:03,540 --> 00:39:59,290
that the move away from science as I'm

694
00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:03,550
perceiving it toward sensationalism in

695
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:06,130
the media and

696
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:09,410
very little concern about the veracity

697
00:40:19,930 --> 00:40:14,930
of the claim sometimes the media would

698
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:19,940
like to focus upon the the kookiest

699
00:40:26,410 --> 00:40:23,450
story that they can find or a domestic

700
00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:26,420
centric experience or that they can find

701
00:40:32,950 --> 00:40:30,610
because it plays well in the media the

702
00:40:36,790 --> 00:40:32,960
average family sitting at home watching

703
00:40:39,430 --> 00:40:36,800
TV like to see that sort of thing but it

704
00:40:42,730 --> 00:40:39,440
removes credibility from the subject

705
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:42,740
matter and a person who like myself who

706
00:40:50,740 --> 00:40:46,370
is interested in the science of all of

707
00:40:55,000 --> 00:40:50,750
this can become very frustrated well the

708
00:40:59,470 --> 00:40:55,010
internet with CGI effects has also

709
00:41:03,070 --> 00:40:59,480
muddied the waters greatly I think yes

710
00:41:06,070 --> 00:41:03,080
yes that is definitely true anybody with

711
00:41:08,980 --> 00:41:06,080
a you know a little bit of knowledge of

712
00:41:16,530 --> 00:41:08,990
Photoshop and a picture of the night sky

713
00:41:20,860 --> 00:41:16,540
can create some form of movie or video

714
00:41:25,210 --> 00:41:20,870
purportedly depicting something alien or

715
00:41:28,180 --> 00:41:25,220
paranormal and it's just a effect that

716
00:41:32,710 --> 00:41:28,190
that's being done through commute

717
00:41:36,220 --> 00:41:32,720
computer-generated effects yes that's

718
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:36,230
very true and and that's more reason for

719
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:38,330
an organization like the mutual UFO

720
00:41:43,740 --> 00:41:41,570
network to continue soldiering on with

721
00:41:46,990 --> 00:41:43,750
what it's been doing for so many years

722
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:47,000
because they are an organization that

723
00:41:54,780 --> 00:41:51,170
focuses upon the science would you say

724
00:41:57,580 --> 00:41:54,790
that in recent years like say the past

725
00:42:02,130 --> 00:41:57,590
seven or eight years certainly that

726
00:42:04,990 --> 00:42:02,140
there has been a paucity of large-scale

727
00:42:09,490 --> 00:42:05,000
sightings in other words by a groups

728
00:42:13,660 --> 00:42:09,500
rather than individuals there has been

729
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:13,670
as from as far as we know now the the

730
00:42:19,510 --> 00:42:17,210
large ones that I know of to place a

731
00:42:19,990 --> 00:42:19,520
while back with the Phoenix lights which

732
00:42:22,930 --> 00:42:20,000
is a very

733
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:22,940
a compelling story where five simonton

734
00:42:29,410 --> 00:42:26,170
the the governor of arizona has come out

735
00:42:31,180 --> 00:42:29,420
and it will 10 years after the event and

736
00:42:33,970 --> 00:42:31,190
stated that it was real and more

737
00:42:36,820 --> 00:42:33,980
recently on television has aided that

738
00:42:40,540 --> 00:42:36,830
the military was aware of it he was on

739
00:42:44,170 --> 00:42:40,550
the phone with them and that it was a

740
00:42:46,930 --> 00:42:44,180
real event it was not military flares in

741
00:42:49,270 --> 00:42:46,940
that time frame so that was very

742
00:42:53,410 --> 00:42:49,280
important of course we had the O'Hare

743
00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:53,420
Airport event which was again covered up

744
00:43:01,240 --> 00:42:57,170
but then in the analysis of the weather

745
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:01,250
pattern that day we found that the the

746
00:43:05,230 --> 00:43:03,170
hole in the cloud could not have been a

747
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:05,240
naturally occurring punch hole plowed

748
00:43:11,410 --> 00:43:08,210
right that and there were so many

749
00:43:14,590 --> 00:43:11,420
credible witnesses to that UFO and then

750
00:43:17,590 --> 00:43:14,600
of course the Steven Stephenson cheese

751
00:43:22,210 --> 00:43:17,600
until yes even's vil sorry Texas

752
00:43:26,830 --> 00:43:22,220
sighting as well very important we

753
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:26,840
haven't had another major event in in

754
00:43:34,210 --> 00:43:29,770
recent years like that but we do have

755
00:43:38,770 --> 00:43:34,220
reports of UFOs hovering low over

756
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:38,780
individuals vehicle it always amazes me

757
00:43:45,460 --> 00:43:41,530
as to why that they should be covered up

758
00:43:47,650 --> 00:43:45,470
there's got to be a sort of a I almost

759
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:47,660
suspect there's an agency with I mean

760
00:43:52,650 --> 00:43:50,570
not to be a conspiracy theory person but

761
00:43:55,570 --> 00:43:52,660
like an agency within the government

762
00:43:58,930 --> 00:43:55,580
that or within some government that is

763
00:44:01,150 --> 00:43:58,940
in charge of covering this up it's just

764
00:44:05,050 --> 00:44:01,160
fascinating to me that it happened so

765
00:44:07,330 --> 00:44:05,060
fast and so effectively that might be an

766
00:44:09,610 --> 00:44:07,340
area of interest of research like who's

767
00:44:11,620 --> 00:44:09,620
doing I'm very fascinated in that

768
00:44:15,010 --> 00:44:11,630
research and I'm turning a lot of

769
00:44:17,830 --> 00:44:15,020
attention to that because good if the

770
00:44:20,050 --> 00:44:17,840
evidence is being covered up if there is

771
00:44:23,170 --> 00:44:20,060
an obfuscation of what is actually going

772
00:44:28,300 --> 00:44:23,180
on then it then how do you really get

773
00:44:32,890 --> 00:44:28,310
down to the nitty-gritty oven when when

774
00:44:33,819 --> 00:44:32,900
you go and look at the history of

775
00:44:35,380 --> 00:44:33,829
government in vol

776
00:44:38,549 --> 00:44:35,390
hoffman in this you can see that there's

777
00:44:43,150 --> 00:44:38,559
been a lot of involvement and that in

778
00:44:45,609 --> 00:44:43,160
1953 the CIA robertson funded Robertson

779
00:44:49,390 --> 00:44:45,619
panel met the Durant report was written

780
00:44:53,049 --> 00:44:49,400
and they had made the decision that it

781
00:44:55,660 --> 00:44:53,059
would be best to cover this up to take

782
00:44:59,469 --> 00:44:55,670
the publish sub public's interest off

783
00:45:03,130 --> 00:44:59,479
this topic part of it was for national

784
00:45:07,829 --> 00:45:03,140
security over our cold war with Russia

785
00:45:10,599 --> 00:45:07,839
but part of it was because they

786
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:10,609
considering what had happened in the

787
00:45:21,309 --> 00:45:17,410
past with war of the worlds and the

788
00:45:24,420 --> 00:45:21,319
broadcast of of that my gosh convenience

789
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:24,430
when it was yes where there was so much

790
00:45:29,529 --> 00:45:27,170
disruption people who were frightened

791
00:45:31,349 --> 00:45:29,539
they they really had to consider the

792
00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:31,359
impact that it would have upon

793
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:34,249
population and of course we had Project

794
00:45:39,039 --> 00:45:37,249
Blue Book that lasted for many many

795
00:45:42,009 --> 00:45:39,049
years until nineteen sixty-nine

796
00:45:44,650 --> 00:45:42,019
sometimes they did a better job at it

797
00:45:49,209 --> 00:45:44,660
than others sometimes it was merely a

798
00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:49,219
cover-up but there was also another

799
00:45:55,660 --> 00:45:52,249
agency that was receiving the most

800
00:45:59,709 --> 00:45:55,670
credible reports the reports that could

801
00:46:02,829 --> 00:45:59,719
affect national security and and there's

802
00:46:05,109 --> 00:46:02,839
no reason to believe that that agency

803
00:46:08,099 --> 00:46:05,119
closed along with Project Blue Book it

804
00:46:11,109 --> 00:46:08,109
appears that it is probably still

805
00:46:15,759 --> 00:46:11,119
occurring but the public is not involved

806
00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:15,769
and the files are not available well

807
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:18,170
looking at that from two different

808
00:46:25,180 --> 00:46:21,729
vantage points we have the opinion of

809
00:46:28,390 --> 00:46:25,190
like say the former MUFON had James

810
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:28,400
carrion that the government was

811
00:46:37,380 --> 00:46:31,249
interested merely because it provided

812
00:46:45,339 --> 00:46:37,390
the UFO field provided a neat cover for

813
00:46:47,050 --> 00:46:45,349
testing military secret aircraft and so

814
00:46:49,390 --> 00:46:47,060
it would draw

815
00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:49,400
Russian agents if you will or you know

816
00:46:55,690 --> 00:46:52,610
any of the Chinese agents I suppose as

817
00:46:59,380 --> 00:46:55,700
well out of the woodwork to look at the

818
00:47:03,190 --> 00:46:59,390
UFOs in that way somehow the government

819
00:47:08,410 --> 00:47:03,200
would catch them as a part from the

820
00:47:10,990 --> 00:47:08,420
normal UFO interested American and then

821
00:47:15,490 --> 00:47:11,000
you can contrast that with two

822
00:47:20,140 --> 00:47:15,500
presidents in the late 20th century both

823
00:47:21,820 --> 00:47:20,150
of whom have made definite statements

824
00:47:24,700 --> 00:47:21,830
that they saw things that they could not

825
00:47:27,790 --> 00:47:24,710
explain that being Jimmy Carter and

826
00:47:30,070 --> 00:47:27,800
Ronald Reagan so you have you have

827
00:47:32,020 --> 00:47:30,080
things that you know you have to kind of

828
00:47:34,180 --> 00:47:32,030
come down in the middle with these

829
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:34,190
things and not not really know what's

830
00:47:38,620 --> 00:47:36,290
going on there with the national

831
00:47:40,810 --> 00:47:38,630
security and what what does the

832
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:40,820
government know I mean we can we can

833
00:47:48,420 --> 00:47:45,890
look at what Colonel John Alexander PhD

834
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:48,430
who was a former guest of ours on on

835
00:47:54,940 --> 00:47:51,530
shattered reality here and he he seems

836
00:47:58,120 --> 00:47:54,950
to feel as though UFOs are real they're

837
00:48:01,660 --> 00:47:58,130
not they're not from any government on

838
00:48:04,330 --> 00:48:01,670
earth but no the government doesn't know

839
00:48:08,140 --> 00:48:04,340
much about them or we can you know go

840
00:48:12,940 --> 00:48:08,150
down another Road which is kind of the

841
00:48:17,770 --> 00:48:12,950
the Richard help me Dolan Richard Dolan

842
00:48:20,470 --> 00:48:17,780
a breakaway society kind of way that

843
00:48:22,540 --> 00:48:20,480
there is a whole subculture that knows

844
00:48:25,180 --> 00:48:22,550
about all these things and is keeping it

845
00:48:29,380 --> 00:48:25,190
from the rest of us and that's also the

846
00:48:32,610 --> 00:48:29,390
David Icke direction so it's it's hard

847
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:32,620
as a thinking individual who tries to

848
00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:36,530
remain objective to an excerpt an extent

849
00:48:41,260 --> 00:48:38,210
but who has experienced certain things

850
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:41,270
on on one hand and on the other hand you

851
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:44,330
want to be objective and say where where

852
00:48:49,930 --> 00:48:47,570
does it come down in the middle yes I me

853
00:48:52,660 --> 00:48:49,940
and I would be suspicious if those who

854
00:48:54,850 --> 00:48:52,670
have radical thoughts about this that

855
00:49:00,490 --> 00:48:54,860
it's all or nothing there is evidence

856
00:49:04,690 --> 00:49:00,500
that the CIA did hoax some UFOs

857
00:49:07,390 --> 00:49:04,700
just for the public reaction but and

858
00:49:09,700 --> 00:49:07,400
there is definitely evidence that we do

859
00:49:11,860 --> 00:49:09,710
have military test vehicles that they

860
00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:11,870
were covering up that does not mean that

861
00:49:17,590 --> 00:49:14,330
everything that has been observed is a

862
00:49:21,730 --> 00:49:17,600
military test vehicle many of them do

863
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:21,740
not have the characteristics of anything

864
00:49:29,290 --> 00:49:26,090
that has been manufactured on earth and

865
00:49:33,670 --> 00:49:29,300
I'm going back historically here back

866
00:49:36,430 --> 00:49:33,680
into the 50s for example where the craft

867
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:36,440
could out flying outmaneuver anything

868
00:49:42,730 --> 00:49:40,490
that we had on earth well even with

869
00:49:46,030 --> 00:49:42,740
Frank Ficino he had something along

870
00:49:47,890 --> 00:49:46,040
those lines too and I think he presents

871
00:49:53,140 --> 00:49:47,900
some pretty solid evidence that there

872
00:49:57,070 --> 00:49:53,150
was a war going on in 1952 that was with

873
00:49:58,840 --> 00:49:57,080
the flybys over DC and he has some

874
00:50:01,030 --> 00:49:58,850
pretty interesting theories to the

875
00:50:02,620 --> 00:50:01,040
problem is these are all theories you

876
00:50:04,870 --> 00:50:02,630
know until you capture one of these

877
00:50:08,410 --> 00:50:04,880
things as you said captured I hope it

878
00:50:11,290 --> 00:50:08,420
works in Reverse one day it's you know

879
00:50:13,330 --> 00:50:11,300
we're all just sort of well you're doing

880
00:50:15,190 --> 00:50:13,340
the best I think gathering as much data

881
00:50:19,540 --> 00:50:15,200
as you can otherwise roads are

882
00:50:22,030 --> 00:50:19,550
speculating that is true and you know

883
00:50:25,740 --> 00:50:22,040
speculation can be fun but it doesn't

884
00:50:29,380 --> 00:50:25,750
get them are in terms of reality right

885
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:29,390
right but yeah I don't they're very

886
00:50:34,210 --> 00:50:31,490
cagey these things i'll tell you all

887
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:34,220
these sightings all these abductions and

888
00:50:38,320 --> 00:50:35,810
you know something's happened somewhere

889
00:50:41,290 --> 00:50:38,330
to people i don't think anyone can deny

890
00:50:43,810 --> 00:50:41,300
that whatever it is something has

891
00:50:45,850 --> 00:50:43,820
happened but boy they're kg there's

892
00:50:49,090 --> 00:50:45,860
never been any solid evidence well i

893
00:50:52,570 --> 00:50:49,100
think that part of the reason is that as

894
00:50:55,450 --> 00:50:52,580
human beings we are dealing with a

895
00:50:58,810 --> 00:50:55,460
certain range of intelligence and I mean

896
00:51:00,880 --> 00:50:58,820
I don't want to talk about IQs but just

897
00:51:03,910 --> 00:51:00,890
using that as an example we have human

898
00:51:06,310 --> 00:51:03,920
beings with IQs of 60 let us say and

899
00:51:10,630 --> 00:51:06,320
then we have human beings with IQs of

900
00:51:14,410 --> 00:51:10,640
200 but we could be dealing with an

901
00:51:16,990 --> 00:51:14,420
alien race or a non-physical ray

902
00:51:20,620 --> 00:51:17,000
shall we say or an interdimensional race

903
00:51:24,460 --> 00:51:20,630
that their intelligence far surpasses

904
00:51:27,130 --> 00:51:24,470
ours and as a result of that we're not

905
00:51:30,190 --> 00:51:27,140
able to cognate eyes what it is that's

906
00:51:33,309 --> 00:51:30,200
going on regardless if as if we are

907
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:33,319
considered on earth like a smart person

908
00:51:38,500 --> 00:51:36,170
or you know not that not the smartest

909
00:51:40,030 --> 00:51:38,510
crayon in the box yeah I would still got

910
00:51:42,190 --> 00:51:40,040
to be something out there I mean they

911
00:51:43,720 --> 00:51:42,200
exist in this world even if temporarily

912
00:51:45,370 --> 00:51:43,730
has got to be something someplace

913
00:51:48,339 --> 00:51:45,380
someone's got to get a nut or bolt

914
00:51:51,460 --> 00:51:48,349
sometime well now we have we have

915
00:51:54,190 --> 00:51:51,470
thousands of pieces of physical trace

916
00:51:57,250 --> 00:51:54,200
evidence yes you do yes have

917
00:51:59,589 --> 00:51:57,260
physiological evidence a lot of this has

918
00:52:03,160 --> 00:51:59,599
been analyzed we have radar evidence

919
00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:03,170
photographic evidence a massive amount

920
00:52:10,170 --> 00:52:06,410
of evidence but it needs to be looked at

921
00:52:15,190 --> 00:52:10,180
by an interdisciplinary team take the

922
00:52:20,020 --> 00:52:15,200
1952 washington DC evidence for example

923
00:52:22,809 --> 00:52:20,030
we had blips on the radar screen we had

924
00:52:25,799 --> 00:52:22,819
a radar operator with 30 years

925
00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:25,809
experience who was highly knowledgeable

926
00:52:33,130 --> 00:52:31,010
about temperature inversion angels on

927
00:52:36,430 --> 00:52:33,140
the screen been caused by temperature

928
00:52:39,220 --> 00:52:36,440
inversion but on that case we also had

929
00:52:44,140 --> 00:52:39,230
military pilots who were scrambled who

930
00:52:46,839 --> 00:52:44,150
had visual sightings of these craft we

931
00:52:49,510 --> 00:52:46,849
had people on the ground who had visual

932
00:52:52,270 --> 00:52:49,520
sightings with these craft when it came

933
00:52:55,839 --> 00:52:52,280
down to the scientific analysis these

934
00:52:59,319 --> 00:52:55,849
things were picked apart the human

935
00:53:03,789 --> 00:52:59,329
beings were said to have possibly had

936
00:53:06,099 --> 00:53:03,799
perceptual errors and the blips on the

937
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:06,109
radar screen were said to because

938
00:53:12,579 --> 00:53:09,890
probably by inversions even though the

939
00:53:16,329 --> 00:53:12,589
radar operator was seeing inversions

940
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:16,339
every night of the week no one ever put

941
00:53:21,849 --> 00:53:18,650
all of those pieces of evidence together

942
00:53:24,700 --> 00:53:21,859
and studied it the way that we would do

943
00:53:27,039 --> 00:53:24,710
a forensic investigation and that's what

944
00:53:28,390 --> 00:53:27,049
I think we really need to do we can't

945
00:53:31,900 --> 00:53:28,400
just separate

946
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:31,910
into little parcel different pieces of

947
00:53:37,210 --> 00:53:34,130
information and not consider it as a

948
00:53:39,870 --> 00:53:37,220
whole I have one question for you about

949
00:53:42,940 --> 00:53:39,880
the evidence and it's very particular

950
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:42,950
type of question and I am separating

951
00:53:53,769 --> 00:53:48,170
something out but I've read you speaking

952
00:53:58,569 --> 00:53:53,779
of or writing of magnetic evidence with

953
00:54:00,730 --> 00:53:58,579
cars and and Barney Hills car having a

954
00:54:03,250 --> 00:54:00,740
magnetic field how many of these

955
00:54:06,789 --> 00:54:03,260
magnetic fields are what known as

956
00:54:10,660 --> 00:54:06,799
monopole monopole magnetic fields and

957
00:54:16,450 --> 00:54:10,670
how many are you know just magnetic

958
00:54:19,319 --> 00:54:16,460
fields that we see elsewhere um what I

959
00:54:22,089 --> 00:54:19,329
can tell you was in on Barney Hills car

960
00:54:24,730 --> 00:54:22,099
there were shiny spots and when he

961
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:24,740
placed a compass embedded as well placed

962
00:54:30,220 --> 00:54:27,890
a compass over the spot the the needle

963
00:54:31,750 --> 00:54:30,230
would spin and spin they were on the

964
00:54:35,710 --> 00:54:31,760
trunk of the car it wasn't up near the

965
00:54:38,890 --> 00:54:35,720
battery this also happened in the case

966
00:54:45,309 --> 00:54:38,900
of Matthew Reed cases that happened in

967
00:54:49,809 --> 00:54:45,319
2009 in Indiana where he was had dropped

968
00:54:56,260 --> 00:54:49,819
off a coworker was returning home on a

969
00:54:59,440 --> 00:54:56,270
back road driving along suddenly he

970
00:55:03,450 --> 00:54:59,450
finds himself in a new location hours

971
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:03,460
have passed his shoes or muddy this was

972
00:55:12,370 --> 00:55:07,130
this case was investigated by MUFON

973
00:55:14,829 --> 00:55:12,380
starting and they did record evidence of

974
00:55:17,710 --> 00:55:14,839
a magnetic field again around the trunk

975
00:55:22,799 --> 00:55:17,720
of the car that the needle on the

976
00:55:26,109 --> 00:55:22,809
compass would spin and there was no

977
00:55:29,140 --> 00:55:26,119
conventional reason why that should have

978
00:55:32,980 --> 00:55:29,150
occurred I think it also occurred in

979
00:55:36,359 --> 00:55:32,990
something in in New Jersey on the New

980
00:55:41,140 --> 00:55:36,369
Jersey Pennsylvania border with a

981
00:55:42,250 --> 00:55:41,150
sighting and a car that was affected the

982
00:55:44,970 --> 00:55:42,260
entire car

983
00:55:48,790 --> 00:55:44,980
was affected with this Magnus unusual

984
00:55:50,290 --> 00:55:48,800
monopole magnetic field I don't know if

985
00:55:54,010 --> 00:55:50,300
you know about that but I guess that's

986
00:55:56,740 --> 00:55:54,020
it's just such a small detail but yet to

987
00:55:58,810 --> 00:55:56,750
me somehow fascinating I would like to

988
00:56:01,810 --> 00:55:58,820
hear all of the cases that I can

989
00:56:04,600 --> 00:56:01,820
possibly hear about this because I find

990
00:56:07,180 --> 00:56:04,610
this fascinating and and you know I'm

991
00:56:11,380 --> 00:56:07,190
wondering if that is in association with

992
00:56:14,680 --> 00:56:11,390
the car being lifted into the air or why

993
00:56:17,130 --> 00:56:14,690
that magnetic field is there we we don't

994
00:56:19,780 --> 00:56:17,140
have the answer I hope some young

995
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:19,790
physicist who's entering a PhD program

996
00:56:25,060 --> 00:56:22,610
hears this and says what's that all

997
00:56:26,440 --> 00:56:25,070
about and gets interested in I think

998
00:56:29,770 --> 00:56:26,450
that's what you need to and I think

999
00:56:32,530 --> 00:56:29,780
that's what you're getting at I think

1000
00:56:35,050 --> 00:56:32,540
that Ken Pfeifer probably has that case

1001
00:56:37,540 --> 00:56:35,060
that I'm speaking of that happened up in

1002
00:56:41,100 --> 00:56:37,550
Sussex County I think he probably has

1003
00:56:44,110 --> 00:56:41,110
access to that case he's the MUFON

1004
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:44,120
coordinator here in New Jersey okay

1005
00:56:53,260 --> 00:56:48,490
great thank you so um before we let you

1006
00:56:56,260 --> 00:56:53,270
get on with your day uh I wonder if you

1007
00:56:58,450 --> 00:56:56,270
have anything of that you would like to

1008
00:57:01,780 --> 00:56:58,460
report to was something that is ongoing

1009
00:57:04,420 --> 00:57:01,790
now a particularly interesting case that

1010
00:57:10,750 --> 00:57:04,430
you have available to share with us or

1011
00:57:13,570 --> 00:57:10,760
anything like that I do not have an

1012
00:57:16,510 --> 00:57:13,580
interesting case right now part of my

1013
00:57:19,180 --> 00:57:16,520
frustration was that I've had two very

1014
00:57:23,140 --> 00:57:19,190
very interesting cases that I have

1015
00:57:24,850 --> 00:57:23,150
worked on they seemed like big cases one

1016
00:57:27,090 --> 00:57:24,860
of them has been ongoing I've been

1017
00:57:31,770 --> 00:57:27,100
investigating this case for three years

1018
00:57:36,700 --> 00:57:31,780
finally we were able to have collect

1019
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:36,710
what was possibly an alien implant it

1020
00:57:45,520 --> 00:57:41,170
was removed by this man's surgeon and

1021
00:57:47,230 --> 00:57:45,530
wrap packaged up and sent to MUFON and

1022
00:57:50,290 --> 00:57:47,240
then sent to our scientists for

1023
00:57:53,620 --> 00:57:50,300
evaluation by the time it ever had

1024
00:57:55,839 --> 00:57:53,630
arrived it had dissolved we've had this

1025
00:57:59,279 --> 00:57:55,849
happen to two implants that

1026
00:58:04,479 --> 00:57:59,289
aware of possible implants let me say

1027
00:58:06,819 --> 00:58:04,489
also I had collected pink discoloration

1028
00:58:09,999 --> 00:58:06,829
on this man's shirt I had the

1029
00:58:12,910 --> 00:58:10,009
photographs of it after he had placed it

1030
00:58:16,539 --> 00:58:12,920
in his closet in a paper bag in the dark

1031
00:58:20,140 --> 00:58:16,549
for two weeks he packaged it up he sent

1032
00:58:22,779 --> 00:58:20,150
it to me I looked at it by the time it

1033
00:58:25,839 --> 00:58:22,789
arrived at the scientist laboratory

1034
00:58:28,690 --> 00:58:25,849
there was not enough pink on it for

1035
00:58:31,599 --> 00:58:28,700
analysis that something is happening to

1036
00:58:33,940 --> 00:58:31,609
the evidence and that is terribly

1037
00:58:37,599 --> 00:58:33,950
frustrating and your Aunt Betty he'll

1038
00:58:40,839 --> 00:58:37,609
also had pink powder on her dress if I

1039
00:58:44,109 --> 00:58:40,849
recall that is correct and and that was

1040
00:58:47,170 --> 00:58:44,119
my reason for asking experiencers to

1041
00:58:50,769 --> 00:58:47,180
take part in this experiment to see if

1042
00:58:54,029 --> 00:58:50,779
we could find pink powder or create pink

1043
00:58:57,400 --> 00:58:54,039
powder so that it could undergo

1044
00:59:03,719 --> 00:58:57,410
laboratory analysis before it actually

1045
00:59:07,299 --> 00:59:03,729
died if in fact it is biological hmm

1046
00:59:09,190 --> 00:59:07,309
interesting but at anyway I guess we

1047
00:59:11,170 --> 00:59:09,200
have sort of come to the end Kathleen

1048
00:59:14,289 --> 00:59:11,180
but please let us hear all about your

1049
00:59:17,559 --> 00:59:14,299
books in your website and where people

1050
00:59:20,469 --> 00:59:17,569
can go to join in if they have had an

1051
00:59:22,359 --> 00:59:20,479
experience where they can contact you so

1052
00:59:25,620 --> 00:59:22,369
that they can share it with the other

1053
00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:25,630
people who have also had experiences

1054
00:59:37,479 --> 00:59:32,210
okay so so my website is Kathleen with a

1055
00:59:41,200 --> 00:59:37,489
k dash mardan ma rden calm in addition

1056
00:59:45,489 --> 00:59:41,210
to my ordering the three books that i

1057
00:59:46,979 --> 00:59:45,499
have had published you can read articles

1058
00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:46,989
that i have written that are absolutely

1059
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:50,690
free and also my up scott upcoming

1060
00:59:55,870 --> 00:59:53,210
speaking engagements are listed on my

1061
00:59:59,920 --> 00:59:55,880
website so please visit the website if

1062
01:00:03,339 --> 00:59:59,930
you have an experience that you wish to

1063
01:00:06,609 --> 01:00:03,349
report please go to muffins website and

1064
01:00:09,039 --> 01:00:06,619
complete the experiencer questionnaire

1065
01:00:09,640 --> 01:00:09,049
which is separate from the experience or

1066
01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:09,650
service

1067
01:00:16,720 --> 01:00:12,890
they're all on the main page at MUFON

1068
01:00:18,490 --> 01:00:16,730
com one is 30 questions that's the one

1069
01:00:21,519 --> 01:00:18,500
you want to complete if you'd like to

1070
01:00:24,670 --> 01:00:21,529
speak to a member of muffins experience

1071
01:00:27,760 --> 01:00:24,680
or research team and possibly make a

1072
01:00:30,849 --> 01:00:27,770
report that would be where you would be

1073
01:00:34,900 --> 01:00:30,859
interviewed by an investigator the other

1074
01:00:37,660 --> 01:00:34,910
one is the experience of survey and

1075
01:00:42,010 --> 01:00:37,670
please if you are an experiencer and you

1076
01:00:44,740 --> 01:00:42,020
remember your experiences at all please

1077
01:00:47,349 --> 01:00:44,750
go there and fill that out it's part of

1078
01:00:49,410 --> 01:00:47,359
a really important scientific study that

1079
01:00:52,059 --> 01:00:49,420
we're doing for the benefit of

1080
01:00:55,269 --> 01:00:52,069
experiencers and also for the benefit of

1081
01:00:57,880 --> 01:00:55,279
the public and of course your books I

1082
01:01:00,430 --> 01:00:57,890
love captured that you're right that

1083
01:01:04,420 --> 01:01:00,440
really although obviously was based on

1084
01:01:06,609 --> 01:01:04,430
their abduction experience it it just

1085
01:01:08,589 --> 01:01:06,619
brought Betty and Barney Hill to life

1086
01:01:11,799 --> 01:01:08,599
they were no longer just a couple who

1087
01:01:15,250 --> 01:01:11,809
had been just abducted by some very

1088
01:01:17,109 --> 01:01:15,260
strange beings but you know it and and

1089
01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:17,119
suddenly realized why they had to be

1090
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:19,130
taken seriously they were very important

1091
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:22,250
members of the community and I was that

1092
01:01:28,180 --> 01:01:25,490
was a great book captured and then this

1093
01:01:30,880 --> 01:01:28,190
newer one alien abduction files is great

1094
01:01:32,950 --> 01:01:30,890
too but mostly I'm looking forward to

1095
01:01:36,549 --> 01:01:32,960
seeing the movie I hope they get it done

1096
01:01:38,890 --> 01:01:36,559
me too and and thank you so much for

1097
01:01:41,500 --> 01:01:38,900
being on shattered reality Kathleen

1098
01:01:43,809 --> 01:01:41,510
Martin yeah thank you for having me I

1099
01:01:45,579 --> 01:01:43,819
appreciate oh you can't it's really been

1100
01:01:47,769 --> 01:01:45,589
great talking to you again we'll have to

1101
01:01:49,900 --> 01:01:47,779
get maybe we can make it out to phoenix

1102
01:01:52,480 --> 01:01:49,910
I don't know yeah that would be fine

1103
01:01:55,569 --> 01:01:52,490
right road trip yeah trip I'd be some

1104
01:01:58,359 --> 01:01:55,579
mood to open be there okay take care now

1105
01:02:03,190 --> 01:01:58,369
bye bye okay you too bye bye bye before

1106
01:02:08,710 --> 01:02:03,200
we go I wanted to just state that today

1107
01:02:13,630 --> 01:02:08,720
is January nineteenth 2016 we are

1108
01:02:17,859 --> 01:02:13,640
Farrugia okay Valentine yes and not only

1109
01:02:20,390 --> 01:02:17,869
that but this is free and uh this is

1110
01:02:24,650 --> 01:02:20,400
free reporting

1111
01:02:27,350 --> 01:02:24,660
of any commercial interests a free

1112
01:02:30,770 --> 01:02:27,360
internet we have nothing to do with the

1113
01:02:33,470 --> 01:02:30,780
mainstream media we have no overlords as

1114
01:02:35,660 --> 01:02:33,480
of yet unless they're aliens and we all

1115
01:02:37,520 --> 01:02:35,670
know it and if we hit on something

1116
01:02:39,650 --> 01:02:37,530
really interesting then we'll find out

1117
01:02:41,570 --> 01:02:39,660
who the overlords are but for right now

1118
01:02:44,690 --> 01:02:41,580
we haven't hit on anything terribly

1119
01:02:48,680 --> 01:02:44,700
interesting so help support us at free

1120
01:02:51,590 --> 01:02:48,690
and open Internet and like us at

1121
01:02:55,490 --> 01:02:51,600
shattered reality podcast on facebook

1122
01:03:02,800 --> 01:02:55,500
which is our our fanpage on facebook and

1123
01:03:06,050 --> 01:03:02,810
our two hour to websites which are

1124
01:03:09,050 --> 01:03:06,060
shattered reality podcast calm and

1125
01:03:11,960 --> 01:03:09,060
shattered reality podcast at

1126
01:03:15,380 --> 01:03:11,970
wordpress.com we're getting the show's

1127
01:03:17,750 --> 01:03:15,390
out on youtube and i think that's about

1128
01:03:20,270 --> 01:03:17,760
it for today oh yes don't forget right

1129
01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:20,280
the experiencers if you are experienced

1130
01:03:26,810 --> 01:03:24,210
or of paranormal phenomena we had a

1131
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:26,820
woman with the bilocation experience

1132
01:03:32,390 --> 01:03:28,890
last week so it doesn't have to be

1133
01:03:36,020 --> 01:03:32,400
aliens paranormal phenomena experiencers

1134
01:03:37,700 --> 01:03:36,030
please let us know yes anytime we always

1135
01:03:39,740 --> 01:03:37,710
love to hear from you of course so I

1136
01:03:42,620 --> 01:03:39,750
guess that wraps up shattered reality